Alonso the Fraud

[Red icon]

Enough said

[chrislandy]

Massa deserved the win, he took the lead on turn one and shouldn't have been ordered to let alonso past - t'was a disappointing end to a good race

[listie]

I hope they get shafted, but just seen on SSN that the team are passing the blame onto Massa, probably due to him not playing the game in the press conference

[ttrw2]

Not really Alonso that's the fraud though - it was team managing that got him there? Nonetheless a complete joke!

I think Rob Smedley dropped a boll0ck in the post-race interview by being nonchalant about it.

[jase]

I think its all a bit pathetic to be honest with whats being made of it. Bit to much sympathy for the likeable Massa and forgeting its motorsport.
Alonso has been considerably faster all year and now Ferrari are drifting away in the fight for the WDC they needed to do this.

Team orders are issued all the time, just Ferrari have been forced to play the most blatent one yet due to there position in the championship.

The fact Alonso dutifully followed a much slower massa earlier in the season with no hint of team orders shows this was something they had to do.



J

[Drew]

shouldnt be allowed, was very dissapointed.

alonso didnt dutily follow massa last time out, he just cant pass very well. as seen in the race today. if he is clearly faster then he should race passed, not be let passed.

Drew

[ttrw2]

Ferrari get fined $100,000:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsp ... 852918.stm

But results remain unchanged, subject to the FIA having a look.

[rover400turbo]

Well up to the lawyers now !!

The stewards have decided they are guilty and have handed out the max punishment they can.

The fact missed is that the WMSC will be looking at not only the rule relating to Team orders, but Rule 151c, the very same that Renualt had to answer for crashgate.

So there is an unlimited punishment, you would think that a suspended team ban, and a larger fine dished out.

[Sheaf]

The thing I dont get is they're very very clever blokes on those teams, it's some amazing technology and they're clearly intelligent.

So, surely it must have occurred to them that they should come up with some kind of plan to tell a driver over the radio to let his teamate pass without being so obvious. I mean, 'Alonso is faster - do you understand?!' or whatever it was wasn't exactly subtle. It doesn't take much to have some reall unobvious code now does it.

I think the whole thing sucks btw, they shouldn't order them over at all, but if they're going to they should be a bit more clever and less obvious about it when it's against the rules!

[ttrw2]

But Smedley/Massa don't want to abide by the team rules - it's a less of two evils. Rob was obvious, followed by Massa being blatant....

[Drew]

maybe they should have told him to save fuel instead.

Drew

[shen]

I think its all a bit pathetic to be honest with whats being made of it. Bit to much sympathy for the likeable Massa and forgeting its motorsport.
Alonso has been considerably faster all year and now Ferrari are drifting away in the fight for the WDC they needed to do this.

Team orders are issued all the time, just Ferrari have been forced to play the most blatent one yet due to there position in the championship.

The fact Alonso dutifully followed a much slower massa earlier in the season with no hint of team orders shows this was something they had to do.



J

they told Massa Alonso is faster so you'll need to let him pass...what's he supposed to do? cause another team accident and take them both out?

Let's say that Alonso didn't pass him and they'd have still got a 1-2 victory would it have been less boring?

[Drew]

whats next then? vettel comes up behind massa, vettel clearly faster, does massa get told to move over for him? no, they race and see who can drive better. thats the whole point of a race.

Drew

[stefaclese]

whats next then? vettel comes up behind massa, vettel clearly faster, does massa get told to move over for him? no, they race and see who can drive better. thats the whole point of a race.

Drew

+1

If Alonso was so much faster than Massa, he would have been able to overtake. Iirc he overtook Massa once, then Massa managed to get passed him again. Again iirc, Alonso's words on the team radio were something like "this is ridiculous".

I think its pretty evident that Alonso was getting frustrated because he wasn't driving well enough to be able to get the lead from Massa legitimately, as can be seen with his usual aggressive driving style. I think its also pretty evident that everyone at Ferrari are lying through their teeth, I find it rather insulting to everyone's intelligence tbh, glad I'm not a Ferrari fanboi and a win that was by far deserved to Massa.

[shen]

whats next then? vettel comes up behind massa, vettel clearly faster, does massa get told to move over for him? no, they race and see who can drive better. thats the whole point of a race.

Drew

wrong...massa holds him up as long as possible to give alonso an even greater lead.
That's the point of having a team...to work as a team.

I don't see anything wrong with team orders, there's more than one team on the track.


IMO F1 is pretty shite anyways and has become progressively more boring as years have gone on.
Every year the cars are restricted more and more, I would just like to see a race series where the manufacturers can build what the hell they want.

[ttrw2]

They're have many open format championships; Group C in the late 80's had a max amount of fuel you could burn in one race, no other regs. Many of the hillclimbing classes are open. They just don't work as it becomes a space-race with the wealthiest manufacturer/team ploughing money in.

[shen]

They're have many open format championships; Group C in the late 80's had a max amount of fuel you could burn in one race, no other regs. Many of the hillclimbing classes are open. They just don't work as it becomes a space-race with the wealthiest manufacturer/team ploughing money in.

Shame they never made group S rallying

[Red icon]

It'snot just this race that makes Alonso a Fraud he hasn't won a race in the last couple of years without someone letting him even to the extent of getting them to crash their car, where ever Alonso go's there's trouble.

[shen]

It'snot just this race that makes Alonso a Fraud he hasn't won a race in the last couple of years without someone letting him even to the extent of getting them to crash their car, where ever Alonso go's there's trouble.

I don't like him either and think there are now many better drivers on the track...still I do think that team orders should be a part of the races, afterall there are quite a few teams out there and they should maximise on having the two drivers out there to get the best season result.

[jase]

Thats where a lot of this fuss about team orders has come from, a general dislike of Alonso.
If Mclaren had faced the same situation in 2008 with Kovy in front of Lewis, they would of made the same call, no question. And... I wouldnt mind betting everyone would of been quite happy with it!

he hasn't won a race in the last couple of years without someone letting him even to the extent of getting them to crash their car

Didint Alonso win at Fuji by out thinking and out pacing faster cars?

J