Rise in fuel etc made you think about giving up fast cars?

[Limecat]

I honestly couldn't give a toss if it was £5 a litre tomorrow. I will keep all of my cars.

[MGJohn]

Hi folks,

Ive noticed alot of people across a few car owners boards talking about giving up their fast (thirsty) cars, as the increase in fuel over recent months, and the increase in Vat is going to make things alot harder than it was, even 6months ago.

I just wondered what your thoughts were/ are ?

Mark

Hell no! My next serious car purchase will be an MG ZT V8.
..

[MGJohn]

Also, consider this addition to the VAT. If you could afford to buy an item costing £117.50p last month, surely you can afford to buy that same item now costing £120.00p with the VAT at the increased rate upped to 20%. An extra £2.50p.
..

[maestrovdpt16]

yeah but it is the fuel duty spiraling up and up that is the bigger issue to come. Soon enough it will be an extra £22.50 on your purchase of £117.50

Most importantly it is a purchase most individuals and businesses don't have a choice in. It is eating directly into the profit and/or income of all involved.

[SubCat001]

In answer to the question a simple no.

My Coupe is off the road for winter and I have to have another car for my job. Perhaps if my only vehicle was the coupe I would be thinking differently but I would probably find a work around.

[Punx0r]

Just had a look and the duty on petrol and diesel went up on 1st Jan by 0.76p/litre. LPG increased by 0.545p/litre.

[Sheaf]

I honestly couldn't give a toss if it was £5 a litre tomorrow. I will keep all of my cars.

Yes you could. If that happened, the cost of everything would increase, pretty much nobody could afford to go anywhere and the country would grind to a halt.

I literally wouldn't be able to use much more than half a tank a month myself if that was the case... (£130ish)

The rest of the VAT rise I'm not too worried about, some things go up, some just stay the same tbh as things that cost say 1.99 in a shop aren't really going to be repriced to £2.03 are they. And tbh, if they did, would I care? My main outgoings are mortgage, council tax, food and petrol, of which the only thing to be affected really is petrol.

[al_leeds]

The Jag is without doubt the best car I have ever owned. Round town the air suspension and burbly engine make for a very nice experience. You can really hustle along as well if the mood takes you.
However a 4.2 litre V8 is not the most appropriate way to tackle a 10 mile a day commute. If I had the money I would probably sell the Jag, buy a small city car with a little bit of poke, and a weekend toy (newer shape XK). But since that isnt likely to happen anytime soon I am sticking with the big old barge for now. I was seeing 22mpg from V Power but since that is now beyond 1.30 a litre i'm back on standard unleaded and 18-19mpg seems to be the max for my driving style. The only other change I will make to respond to the petrol price is use the wife's little 1.5 Swift more often, its not too bad for short trips and it makes me value the XJ more when I go back to it!

[radddogg]

I honestly couldn't give a toss if it was £5 a litre tomorrow. I will keep all of my cars.

Yes you could. If that happened, the cost of everything would increase, pretty much nobody could afford to go anywhere and the country would grind to a halt.

No I'd still be zipping around with my head tucked down.


Neeeeeeeeeeeeeeooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooowwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww

[Punx0r]

If petrol was that expensive I think a lot of other people would have a similar idea and Birmingham would look Saigon

However a 4.2 litre V8 is not the most appropriate way to tackle a 10 mile a day commute.

I contest that such a car is an ideal way to tackle a 10 mile commute! If you had to commute 100 miles then the lack of fuel economy would bite you. At the mileage you do, the savings to be had from a car that does twice the mpg would be insignificant. Your short commute allows you the luxury of running a large, thirsty car

[smithy1135]

I considered giving up a thirsty car, but whats the point? The economy is at an all time low, selling it would return about 20% of the money I have in it, and you pay a premium on a diesel car these days because everyone wants them!

Oh and where would I get my kicks/adrenaline rushes if I didnt have a Rover turbo in my life?!

[vinny19791]

Not tempted on giving up

Just bought a 3.0 v6 406 coupe swell as the turbo

Cheers lol

[Sheaf]

If petrol was that expensive I think a lot of other people would have a similar idea and Birmingham would look Saigon

However a 4.2 litre V8 is not the most appropriate way to tackle a 10 mile a day commute.

I contest that such a car is an ideal way to tackle a 10 mile commute! If you had to commute 100 miles then the lack of fuel economy would bite you. At the mileage you do, the savings to be had from a car that does twice the mpg would be insignificant. Your short commute allows you the luxury of running a large, thirsty car

Yeah, but I'm guessing it takes 5 miles to warm it up even...

This is what I'm finding. Most of the time I'm either stuck with a cold engine (and strangely enough don't go anywhere near the high revs unless it's warm) or I'm stuck in traffic. I pretty much never go any faster than your average commuter in a 1.4 fiesta on the commute.
If I'm honest, I'd prefer a diesel to commute in for the actual drive, hell I'd prefer an small engined petrol auto for the commute, would be so much easier on my left leg and my wallet.

However, on those occasions where I go further afield, the engine's nice and warm and I can actually enjoy it, I smile and think 'I can never let this go'.

Plus, I personally love the looks of the car and when I walk back to it, it makes me smile. I don't think I could ever have one single car which is both slow and unattractive. It means your car is solely a tool, not a prized possession, which is not what I see a car as. I could probably put up with a 'nippy' diesel, but it'd have to be a nice looking car, say like a 3 series coupe or a Leon FR. Having say a derv focus C max for example (a mate has one, hence it springs to mind) would just depress me so much. It's like just giving up.

And yeah, I think in the long term saving on the silly service costs of modern cars (both petrol and diesel) is making up for it. Most of the new ones are stupidly compact and I'm not sure I'd feel as confident working on them all. It's all error codes, sensors and other electronic crap that is expensive when it breaks... dealers rape your wallet on every visit.

If you're getting a newish car now, I think diesel or atleast economical petrol is the way to go, but the cost of switching from a more simple older car and upgrading to a newer car that depreciates more, costs a load to buy and costs more in servicing presently outweighs the fuel costs. It's just more visible when you see the money going in petrol.

[Punx0r]

As someone recently mentioned, small petrol autos often return much lower economy that you might imagine based on their engine size.

IIRC the jag V8s are all alloy? In this case I can't see your average iron-blocked diesel warming up quicker.

It's not just about using the performance, even if you can't go fast big cars are usually nice places to sit. An old 1.4 fiesta might be as fast in traffic but I'd still prefer something with heated leather, climate control, good stereo etc.

[al_leeds]

If petrol was that expensive I think a lot of other people would have a similar idea and Birmingham would look Saigon

However a 4.2 litre V8 is not the most appropriate way to tackle a 10 mile a day commute.

I contest that such a car is an ideal way to tackle a 10 mile commute! If you had to commute 100 miles then the lack of fuel economy would bite you. At the mileage you do, the savings to be had from a car that does twice the mpg would be insignificant. Your short commute allows you the luxury of running a large, thirsty car

Yeah, but I'm guessing it takes 5 miles to warm it up even...

This is what I'm finding. Most of the time I'm either stuck with a cold engine (and strangely enough don't go anywhere near the high revs unless it's warm) or I'm stuck in traffic. I pretty much never go any faster than your average commuter in a 1.4 fiesta on the commute.
If I'm honest, I'd prefer a diesel to commute in for the actual drive, hell I'd prefer an small engined petrol auto for the commute, would be so much easier on my left leg and my wallet.

However, on those occasions where I go further afield, the engine's nice and warm and I can actually enjoy it, I smile and think 'I can never let this go'.

Plus, I personally love the looks of the car and when I walk back to it, it makes me smile. I don't think I could ever have one single car which is both slow and unattractive. It means your car is solely a tool, not a prized possession, which is not what I see a car as. I could probably put up with a 'nippy' diesel, but it'd have to be a nice looking car, say like a 3 series coupe or a Leon FR. Having say a derv focus C max for example (a mate has one, hence it springs to mind) would just depress me so much. It's like just giving up.

And yeah, I think in the long term saving on the silly service costs of modern cars (both petrol and diesel) is making up for it. Most of the new ones are stupidly compact and I'm not sure I'd feel as confident working on them all. It's all error codes, sensors and other electronic crap that is expensive when it breaks... dealers rape your wallet on every visit.

If you're getting a newish car now, I think diesel or atleast economical petrol is the way to go, but the cost of switching from a more simple older car and upgrading to a newer car that depreciates more, costs a load to buy and costs more in servicing presently outweighs the fuel costs. It's just more visible when you see the money going in petrol.

I wrote my original post in a hurry at work and didnt really think- its a ten mile round trip and it normally warms up just as I get into the car park at work.
In the snowy weather the fuel consumption was down at 9.5MPG

I'm just the same as you Sheaf- bimbling along at 30mph in the traffic to and from work doesnt allow me to sample the (many) dynamic talents of the old girl- but it is a fantastic place to be, especially on an evening when you are sitting in stop start traffic getting more and more annoyed at some of the dubious practices that pass for driving these days. You can turn up the music, sink deeper into the nice leather heated seats and let the stresses of the world wash over you. Im not sure that would be possible in a modern supermini with tacky plastic and hard as nails seats.
But where my petrol head side really comes out is on a crisp sunday morning when I have just dropped the wife off to work and I don't have anywhere to be, there are some cracking deserted B roads to play with and I can hear the engine howling away at 6k+ RPM on the straight bits, and (I think) I am clipping every apex and really pushing on in the twisty bits- there is absolutely no better feeling in the world. On those days there is no way I am giving my car up for something more economical. It is a shame that those kinds of days are now few and far between...

[Sheaf]

I honestly couldn't give a toss if it was £5 a litre tomorrow. I will keep all of my cars.

Yes you could. If that happened, the cost of everything would increase, pretty much nobody could afford to go anywhere and the country would grind to a halt.

No I'd still be zipping around with my head tucked down.


Neeeeeeeeeeeeeeooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooowwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww

[vfr16v]

Fuel (RON 98) was in Poland £1.08 (2 days ago) and in the Netherlands £1.42 (RON95) per litre!!

[Limecat]

I honestly couldn't give a toss if it was £5 a litre tomorrow. I will keep all of my cars.

Yes you could. If that happened, the cost of everything would increase, pretty much nobody could afford to go anywhere and the country would grind to a halt.

No I couldn't, hence why I stated it on my post.

If you are talking about distribution costs etc then the cost of what they are delivering would not increase by the percentile increase of petrol.

I honestly wouldn't care if it was £5 a litre. It would get people off the roads so I have a clear run, it beats using petrol sat in a queue.

[radddogg]

I honestly couldn't give a toss if it was £5 a litre tomorrow. I will keep all of my cars.

Yes you could. If that happened, the cost of everything would increase, pretty much nobody could afford to go anywhere and the country would grind to a halt.

No I couldn't, hence why I stated it on my post.

If you are talking about distribution costs etc then the cost of what they are delivering would not increase by the percentile increase of petrol.

I honestly wouldn't care if it was £5 a litre. It would get people off the roads so I have a clear run, it beats using petrol sat in a queue.

Now you've just proved that your ego rules your mouth. Are you seriously saying that a) you genuinely believe that the cost of fuel at £5 a litre would not have an extremely adverse effect on the retail cost of all retail items? and b) that even if it did you would still be happy to pay £1.50 for a banana?

[Red icon]

Just had a look and the duty on petrol and diesel went up on 1st Jan by 0.76p/litre. LPG increased by 0.545p/litre.

and as we can't put 0.76p on a litre it will be 1p, along with the 1p in October and the increase in VAT this goverment has put 5/6p on a litre since they came to power last May [ which is more than LABOUR HAD DONE IN THE LAST 10 YEARS]. but it's not just the price of petrol after years of bringing my car [VVC Coupe] insurance down this year it went from £130 to £177 the reason new goverment policies, they won't say what they are just new goverment policies and the road tax went up £30. My 75 tourer V6 does 23mpg as most is short trips, It now costs twice to fill it up then it did when I got it 3 years ago. Will I change it, I don't want to but it's getting expense to run and as for the insurance for it we will see in March

[Punx0r]

Yep, the ZOG machine is pulling the strings on the puppet governments and artifically raising insurance costs in order to achieve something sinister. Not sure what yet...

and as we can't put 0.76p on a litre it will be 1p, along with the 1p in October and the increase in VAT this goverment has put 5/6p on a litre since they came to power last May [ which is more than LABOUR HAD DONE IN THE LAST 10 YEARS].

[alexcornwall]

I sold up/gave up the fast cars.... Not that i couldn't afford it. Just felt with the hike in insurance also, the juice just wasn't worth the squeeze!

[stefaclese]

I sold up/gave up the fast cars.... Not that i couldn't afford it. Just felt with the hike in insurance also, the juice just wasn't worth the squeeze!

You'll be the next Radddddddddddddddders before you can say "Scooterette"

[alexcornwall]

I sold up/gave up the fast cars.... Not that i couldn't afford it. Just felt with the hike in insurance also, the juice just wasn't worth the squeeze!

You'll be the next Radddddddddddddddders before you can say "Scooterette"

Haha, just in the process of buying a road legal quad, not quite as gay i guess

[Red icon]

Yep, the ZOG machine is pulling the strings on the puppet governments and artifically raising insurance costs in order to achieve something sinister. Not sure what yet...

and as we can't put 0.76p on a litre it will be 1p, along with the 1p in October and the increase in VAT this goverment has put 5/6p on a litre since they came to power last May [ which is more than LABOUR HAD DONE IN THE LAST 10 YEARS].

That shows how much tax the goverment got , as the price of a litre went up so did the tax, just because it cost more BUT what the Labour party actually put on was only a few pence. They witheld adding duty for a couple of years due to the price of crude and at one point actually deducted some.

[Limecat]

If the government cut off the lazy career spongers in this World you wouldn't have to pay so much tax. EVERYTHING would be cheaper.

Sod blaming the government, blame the lazy.

[tyke71]

I'll start again, as my last thread went on too long and was hard work to read as Limelight quoated,
Impenetrable wall of text is impenetrable.

It depends on your circumstances, like me with the ZT Diesel it cost me finance and £80-90 a month for local running around. When the recession hit my job went down to 3days a week but survived because the morgage was very low. I couldn't afford a unexpected bill on the ZT and finally got rid of her and got the Panda, which was costing the same to run as the ZT, paying more finance, but £35month on petrol and with 3yrs warranty and £250 to tax and insure for 12months it took the pressure of. Like i said Ross fixed the coupe and only used that when i needed it for the long runs. Well i bought the cabby for a 2nd car as it was cheaper to tax,insure and run on a 1.4 then using the coupe. But like i said found storage and decided to keep the coupe. But it's still cheaper to run a family car then using public transport, as my trip to my parents cost me £40. If i got taxis to the station it would be £15 then £15 again from the station, so in total it would be £60 in taxis without costing for the train/coach. So the fuel goes up and so do the fares(we can't win). When i finally telled my wife that i am still going to keep the coupe and explained in 2yrs time when the Panda goes it's still be cheaper to run the cabby/coupe as no finance to pay as cars paid for compaired to the cheapest run about the Panda. Hope this makes better sense to read. If not, tough.

[stefaclese]

I blame Thatcher, Dwayne and Anthony tbh.

[rovermadman4825]

Yes blame me I bet your wife hates me

[Limecat]

Nearly 3yrs ago i bought a MG ZT Diesel and filled it up at the pumps when the diesel was high and cost me £90 i was shocked. Well my job and taking my kids to my parents the odd wkend used high miles so wasn't too bad but still costing me more in fuel. Then my job changed and wasn't driving more then 10miles a day to work and if i picked my boy up from school or nipped to the shops it wasn't more than a mile away. Anyway the fuel economy went through the roof and was drinking it like noibody buisness as the car wasn't getting too running temp with the short trips. Then my Rover coupe turbo which was parked most of the time because of the price of petrol devoloped what i thought a head gasket problem. Cutting a story short and my job circumstances working less days and having to keep a tight hold of the money, i had enough of the running cost of the cars and decided to trade the coupe in under the scrappage scheme and get £2000 for her and sell the ZT at the same time. Well the deal went ahead and i got a New Fiat Panda(DON'T LAUGH) which was £225 to insure and £35 road tax for the year and £28 for a full tank and was economal and came with a 3yr warranty. Well after handing over £100 deposit and getting home i was looking at other dealerships offers on Panda's and with the finance found i was only going to get £1000 for the coupe. So went back the next day and telled them to stuff the deal and keep the deposit has i wasn't going to get ripped off with the scrappage scheme. Anyway to keep me happy, they offered me the new car for the same deal and i kept the coupe to fix. Sorry but i wasn't sad to see the ZT go after the money it cost to run and got my Panda and joined Rovertech for help on the coupe. Well Ross (rovermadman) answered my distress calls and fixed the coupe , which was an airlock! I topped the coolant up one day and crossed threaded the cap because of the strut brace not getting my hands in to fit it correct. I felt a right idiot and nearly scrapped the car because of the coolant cap. I can't thank Ross enough for saving the car as nobody lives near me on Rovercoupe.net to have a look and all the garage would say (Rover it's common headgasket)! Not long after Fiat was offering the Panda after the scrappage scheme finished for the same price. I coulnd't live with myself if i got the turbo scrapped for nothing. Well my job was on 3days but used to get more money working on the agency 2-3 days extra a week and having the Panda so me through as it was costing me £35 month to fill up and was breaking even with the running cost of the ZT including the finance. Just a peace of mind that i wasn't going to get it with a massive bill if it brokedown, especially when reading a thread about a member buying a ZT diesel cost £1350 to replace the clutch. Well the Panda got me through the hardtimes and kept the coupe for long distance runs to my parents with the kids and ran the Panda for everyday use. Well if you have seen my thread on the coupe in gallery i have got her back to nearly original and spotted a Cabriolet with 20,000 miles from new near where i live. I couldn't let it go and got the Rover buzz and bought it and got all the parts to make it look like CARL747 cabby even got the Roversport front bumper. Then i was going to sell the coupe and run the cabby instead because of the fuel cost. That's what i said to my wife anyway to get the cabby, but when time come i couldn't bare to sell the coupe and quickly found a storage site with cover to ease the situation after having 3 cars on the drive and only needing 1. So the point of this thread, i don't smoke, don't drink very much and don't get chance to watch my football team anymore and my Rovers are my hobby and don't drive them much anyway to cost to much on fuel and use the Panda for keeping the running cost down. Well in 2yrs time when my youngest his 4yrs old the Panda is going and having my Cabby for local work and enjoy in the summer with the top down and the coupe for the long journeys and when i want a blast in it. So sod the goverment as it's still cheaper to run a car then catching public transport any place. Example i had to go down to Sheffield 2wkends on the trot and had to use the Panda to keep the cost down due to 2trips and cost me £80 to cover 600mile petrol costing £1.23. So for 1trip it cost me £40 for the family. If i got a taxi too the station it would cost me £15 and same again at the other end so that's £30, how much would it cost me for the family to get the train or the coach on top of the taxis. So for a family it's still cheaper to run a car and will keep on running the Rovers. Well that's my rant against fuel, sorry for the long read if you got that far. Well a massive thankyou to Ross for sorting out the coupe, but like i said to Ross, i blame him for fixing the car, has i have 3cars now instead off 1.

Impenetrable wall of text is impenetrable.

[MGTurbo]

Nearly 3yrs ago i bought a MG ZT Diesel and filled it up at the pumps when the diesel was high and cost me £90 i was shocked. Well my job and taking my kids to my parents the odd wkend used high miles so wasn't too bad but still costing me more in fuel. Then my job changed and wasn't driving more then 10miles a day to work and if i picked my boy up from school or nipped to the shops it wasn't more than a mile away. Anyway the fuel economy went through the roof and was drinking it like noibody buisness as the car wasn't getting too running temp with the short trips. Then my Rover coupe turbo which was parked most of the time because of the price of petrol devoloped what i thought a head gasket problem. Cutting a story short and my job circumstances working less days and having to keep a tight hold of the money, i had enough of the running cost of the cars and decided to trade the coupe in under the scrappage scheme and get £2000 for her and sell the ZT at the same time. Well the deal went ahead and i got a New Fiat Panda(DON'T LAUGH) which was £225 to insure and £35 road tax for the year and £28 for a full tank and was economal and came with a 3yr warranty. Well after handing over £100 deposit and getting home i was looking at other dealerships offers on Panda's and with the finance found i was only going to get £1000 for the coupe. So went back the next day and telled them to stuff the deal and keep the deposit has i wasn't going to get ripped off with the scrappage scheme. Anyway to keep me happy, they offered me the new car for the same deal and i kept the coupe to fix. Sorry but i wasn't sad to see the ZT go after the money it cost to run and got my Panda and joined Rovertech for help on the coupe. Well Ross (rovermadman) answered my distress calls and fixed the coupe , which was an airlock! I topped the coolant up one day and crossed threaded the cap because of the strut brace not getting my hands in to fit it correct. I felt a right idiot and nearly scrapped the car because of the coolant cap. I can't thank Ross enough for saving the car as nobody lives near me on Rovercoupe.net to have a look and all the garage would say (Rover it's common headgasket)! Not long after Fiat was offering the Panda after the scrappage scheme finished for the same price. I coulnd't live with myself if i got the turbo scrapped for nothing. Well my job was on 3days but used to get more money working on the agency 2-3 days extra a week and having the Panda so me through as it was costing me £35 month to fill up and was breaking even with the running cost of the ZT including the finance. Just a peace of mind that i wasn't going to get it with a massive bill if it brokedown, especially when reading a thread about a member buying a ZT diesel cost £1350 to replace the clutch. Well the Panda got me through the hardtimes and kept the coupe for long distance runs to my parents with the kids and ran the Panda for everyday use. Well if you have seen my thread on the coupe in gallery i have got her back to nearly original and spotted a Cabriolet with 20,000 miles from new near where i live. I couldn't let it go and got the Rover buzz and bought it and got all the parts to make it look like CARL747 cabby even got the Roversport front bumper. Then i was going to sell the coupe and run the cabby instead because of the fuel cost. That's what i said to my wife anyway to get the cabby, but when time come i couldn't bare to sell the coupe and quickly found a storage site with cover to ease the situation after having 3 cars on the drive and only needing 1. So the point of this thread, i don't smoke, don't drink very much and don't get chance to watch my football team anymore and my Rovers are my hobby and don't drive them much anyway to cost to much on fuel and use the Panda for keeping the running cost down. Well in 2yrs time when my youngest his 4yrs old the Panda is going and having my Cabby for local work and enjoy in the summer with the top down and the coupe for the long journeys and when i want a blast in it. So sod the goverment as it's still cheaper to run a car then catching public transport any place. Example i had to go down to Sheffield 2wkends on the trot and had to use the Panda to keep the cost down due to 2trips and cost me £80 to cover 600mile petrol costing £1.23. So for 1trip it cost me £40 for the family. If i got a taxi too the station it would cost me £15 and same again at the other end so that's £30, how much would it cost me for the family to get the train or the coach on top of the taxis. So for a family it's still cheaper to run a car and will keep on running the Rovers. Well that's my rant against fuel, sorry for the long read if you got that far. Well a massive thankyou to Ross for sorting out the coupe, but like i said to Ross, i blame him for fixing the car, has i have 3cars now instead off 1.

TBH

[tyke71]

Well did apologise for the thread. but gave you something to whine and complain about tonight and had to get that off my chest. Well had to say the goverment is doing it's best to stop all our pleasures and i am not letting my Rovers go because of the fuel prices. Ross my wife doesn't hate you, but blames me for what she says is a mid life crisis at 39.

[Punx0r]

Yes blame me I bet your wife hates me

Don't be silly, Stef doesn't have a wife He's civil-ceremonied to Vard.

That shows how much tax the goverment got , as the price of a litre went up so did the tax, just because it cost more BUT what the Labour party actually put on was only a few pence. They witheld adding duty for a couple of years due to the price of crude and at one point actually deducted some.

There doesn't seem much info on the net of detailed historic rates of fuel duty, but the good old HMRC has a nice table for all fuel (including private aviation) for the last twenty years:

http://customs.hmrc.gov.uk/channelsPort ... OD1_023552

Unleaded petrol duty 15/08/97: 40.28p
Unleaded petrol duty 01/04/10: 57.19p

I make that a ~17 pence rise. Plus, as you say, the higher the duty and base cost, the greater the VAT amount.

It is interesting to see that the duty between 2000 and 2003 didn't change.

[edward22]

all i can say is fuel goes up the fuel tax goes up . when was the last time they raised the governmental tax allowance for car usage and fuel for business usage!

[russ220]

i got annoyed few years back when they whacked the fuel up, made me not want to finish my D16 engine build (which i still haven't). i wanted to drop my high compression D16 DOHC into a facelift ZS to be different.

In the end i went and got a derv ZS, even though diesel is more money at the pump im still making a saving MPG wise, not to mention the saving on road tax and insurance. Still sh1t though as its not what i wanted to do but...the fact i only fill up every 2 weeks now is kinda...